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Proceedings of of the Kohimarama Conference, Comprising Nos. 13 to 18 of the "Maori Messenger."

Friday, July 20th, 1860

page 52

Friday, July 20th, 1860.

In opening to-day's proceedings the Native Secretary suggested that Tamati Waka should commence the speeches; and that he should be followed by Nopera, and Te Awarahi, and other chiefs who had only recently arrived and had not yet addressed the Conference.

Tamati Waka Nene, (Ngapuhi,) Bay of Islands:—These are my words. I shall now have something to say. What has been said before was unimportant, merely a first attempt. We have not arrived at any thing definite. For a fortnight past we have been talking. To me the time has seemed two months. Our first speeches were correct. I stand partly in doubt of you the Chiefs of this Conference: it is well that you should speak your sentiments; you are from the South, I am from the North, from the tail end of our Island. The reason I now stand up to speak is that I see strangers here who have newly arrived. I am searching for the cause which has brought us here. Is it Te Rangitake, or is it the king movement? Te Wherowhero was my friend in time past. I am here, Te Wherowhero there. My friend has been taken from our midst, and from the presence of the Governor. What is it that has taken away my friend who is now gone? Was it you who took him or who? My friend was taken away and called a king. When Te Rangitake heard this, he thought, I have now a king, I will join this. Accordingly he proceeded with his work. I had thought that amongst all our tribes Waikato was the only one which held an independent position. The other tribes have lost their position. All kind of European goods have been taken into Waikato; there is nothing that has not found its way there. Ploughs and all kinds of useful things have through the Governor been intro duced into Waikato; there is nothing which he has not sent to the Chiefs of this land. When the Governor came we began to cast about and to think, perhaps we shall lose our lands, but no, the pakeha said, Friends, let a portion of your lands be for us. The land has not been put on board their ships and carried away. It is still here with us. Perhaps the taking away of my friend is connected with this. If they (the Europeans) had gone and fetched Tamati page 53 Waaka, or Porutu, to clear the land for them, then I would have said this is an evil Governor. But the pakeha came with his own spade, therefore I say no wrong has been done to us. According to my notion, now that Potatau is; dead, the work of Waikato should be put an end to. He uttered no evil words, nor any words about fighting. His only word was, good will and kindness. This was his word, wash me that I may be clean: hence I say let that name be washed out, let each tribe cherish its own pakehas. You say the the Governor is doing wrong in taking the land; my opinion is that it is Te Rangitake who was wrong. He desired the things which were given as a payment for Taranaki. You talk about the Governor's wrong. Listen, all of you, the payment given for my lands was scissors and pipes. These lands (at Taranaki) I hear were paid for in silver. Perhaps this conference is now thinking, pshaw! his talk indeed, what is the talk of this man brought here for? This is the way I propose to destroy evil,—by kindness,—kindn ss to the pakehas, even to the end, even as I cherish my pakehas. That is all I shall say. my words are but desultory.

Nopera, (Ngatiwhatua,) Kaipara:—Listen ye to the purport of my speech. I am about to speak of my pakehas, of my parents, my elder brothers, and my younger brothers. They were dead and are restored, they were lost and are returned. These are my parents who drew me forth to life. Here is the cause of my being able to look forth upon the mountains and plains. It is through my pakehas. Listen, my words appear in the Governor's newspapers. If a Maori be killed by a pakeha, let the pakeha be given up as payment for his offence. If a pakeha should be killed by a maori, let the Maori be given up as payment for his offence: the two are thus treated alike, and peace and unity will continue. Here is no cause of division; the murderer is himself the payment—be expiates his crime. If the Maori steal the goods of the pakeha let him be the payment, for his sin is his own; if he drink rum in the town the payment for his trausgression should be himself: whether he be a chief or of inferior rank, he should be given up to the law of the pakeha. If these are carried out, then our union will be a reality. If a pakeha wantonly commits an act of violence upon the people of any tribe, let the matter be arranged between themselves; if the act should be done to myself or tribe it will be for me to arrange about it, if we act upon this principle we shall dwell in peace. I have committed myself to the direction of the Governor. We shall not be separated from the Governor. To the first, to the second, to the third, and to the fourth Governor my page 54 words have been and remain the same. We will not part for ever, and ever, Amen !

Katipa Te Awarahi, (Ngatiteata) Waiuku:—Listen, Te Waka, both you and Mr. McLean. It is true that I have acted presumptously with regard to this name of King. It was not we, however, who originated it; it was Taupo, and Whanganui who set up the name of King. These were its supporters, Te Moananui. (Wm. Thompson Tarapipipi), Te Heuheu, and Tamihana. Potatau never desired the name of King; he preferred the name of Father. Te Waka says he condemns this (King movement) and he is quite right. I said the same to Te Heuheu, to Turoa, and to Te Moananui. I asked them what good is there in the name of King? Potatau was altogether misled; he did not enter the King project or favor it in any way. He said, Wash me, I shall die; this people have compassed my death. This was spoken at the Waiuku meeting. He said also, let not the Maories quarrel with the Pakeha. Such were his sentiments. I now say the Governor has been very good. I have nothing to say against him. But, I ask, Who will wash the blood from the hand of Te Rangitake? who shall wash the blood from the hand of the Governor? It must be done by themselves. There is also this word, Let not the gnat be strained at while the camel is swallowed.

Te Ao-o-te-rangi, (Tainui,) Waiuku:—As for me, I know nothing about this work at Waikato; I am in ignorance respecting it. I have. not understood the object of that work. I should say that this name of Waikato is merely a name. Te Katipa has named the tribes who set this project on foot. It came from the interior and from the South. Potatau's wish was, that the name of parent should be adopted. You have heard what I said, that this name of Waikato is but a name. I now, for the first time, see what has been going on in the South. Waikato has only come in at the completion of the design. You say, the King must be put down because Potatau is dead. I say, the intentions of the Waikato cannot be stolen from them. I cannot pretend to state them. I live on the sea coast; Waikato is inland. I was left by you in ignorance respecting this matter, and therefore I do not understand it. Listen, the Pakeha is not of to-day; it is long since he came here. The ministers came; this was one great benefit. Afterwards came another system, and I continued to observe. This is: what I have to say to you Mr. McLean and Te Waka. Be kind to the Maories of New Zealand, to the dark-skins. If I (the Maori) turn upon you to injure you, then you and I will act in concert If the Governor becomes the aggressor and does wrong to me (the page 55 Maori). then I shall turn away. The main thing which we are told to regard is the law As to Te Rangitake's affair; it is not understood, nor do we know the thoughts to of Te Rangitake. Waikato is the only independent tribe now existing. As to the intentions of Waikato, who knows what they may be?

PetaeraWharerahi, (Ngatituwharetoa,) Taupo:—I have come from among the King party. I belong to the Arawa; through my mother I am connected with Tarawera, Rotokakahi, and Te Rotoiti; these are my people. I became detached through my father. The word which Tukihaumene and Parakaia have spoken I confirm, they have spoken my sentiments. I refer to what they said (about allegiance) to the Queen. It was through a slave that I saw Ngapuhi. I applied to the ministers and obtained (my wish). My object was to prevent Te Waka from coming back to destroy us. Afterwards ministers came and lived among us. All the other tribes have parted with their lands; I have not parted with my land, and my thoughts have remained clear (no cause of dissatisfaction). There was evil with Heke, evil at Port Nicholson, and evil at Whanganui, while I continued to dwell in peace. There is now evil with Te Rangitake, but I shall not go astray. The Maories desire to sell their lands, and the Pakehas desire (to buy them). After the money has been received, an attempt is made to take the land back again. If it be a case where blood has been shed, I shall not take up the quarrel. If it be that you wrongfully take my land without payment, I shall have to consider that.

Mete Kingi, (Ngatiapa,) Whangauui:—The words of the Governor have been read by this Conference; but some of them have not been replied to. The Governor has sent down three Messages to the Conference; I have them but shall not attempt to answer them now. I will take them to my house and there consider them. Mr. McLeau, these were prepared by the Governor and you in your houses, and in this way you found your good thoughts. Enough on that subject. This refers to what was said by Te Awarahi about Turoa. How many years have you been waiting for the return of those first concerned in the project. Three years probably. It was a lad who came to us about it, this childish affair, and as young men when they see the haka must join in it, so this attracted some. This youth returned up the Whanganui to Pehi (Turoa) but he did not come back. We said to him,—Son, there is a bird called the Huia, and there is another called the Kokako. The feathers of the Kokako were stolen by the Huia. This Maori King project most probably will fail the name is borrowed from the pakeha. It was page 56 this which caused that young man to remain away; he did not return again to agitate the King question. Enough on that subject. Listen, Mr. McLean, if the Governor and you should think of convening another meeting, let it be at Whanganui. Mr. McLean let your second Conference be held at Whanganui: this word is from Turoa and the old men from whom we have come. It is also Hori's (Te Anaua) and, indeed, that of all the people. This is in token of our appreciation and desire to meet the views of the Governor and yourself. Mr. McLean, let your work be like that of the Bishop. He carries on the work of instruction year by year until his pupils attain to knowledge and are fitted to become Ministers. In like manner let the Governor and you be constantly teaching. Let your second Conference be at Whanganui. The Governor and you are known by the Ngapuhi, the Ngatipaoa, the Ngatimaru, and Waikato. I see the Governor only as a breeze that passes by and is gone, but these people see him continually.

Tamihana te Rauparaha, (Ngatitoa,) Otaki:—My heart is glad. Te Waka was the friend of my father. If Te Rauparaha were alive they would be of the same mind and both would be with the Governor. These Waikato difficulties are still present. Will not the people consent that this Maori King project should be put an end to, so that we may live together as brethren? In days gone by the Maori knew no greater delicacy than that which a cannibal feast furnished. This practice dates from the emigration from Hawaiki. By whom have we been induced to abandon this practice of cannibalism? By the Pakeha. We are now Pakehas. Look at the Maori dog-skin mats, at the flax garments, at the ornamental feathers worn by the Maories. These are not considered superior to the European clothing now worn by the Maories. We have received and become possessed of the good things of the European, and one of us here present has been ordained a Minister, and you have seen his efficiency. Let us look and see which is the best, our system or that of the pakeha. So also with regard to this invention of ours which is said to have originated in the South. Is this a thing to be preferred to the system of the Pakeha? Tamati Waka is a man of consistency, and he says that the King project should be given up. As to the flag that was brought to my place at Kapiti, I said, Take it back to Maungatautari, to the place of your forefathers' boundary, and if the people there say Set it up, then erect it there; it they say, Cast it aside, then take it where you like. Potatau was a Chief, and my idea is, that if he had lived he would have been the friend of Te Waka and of the Governor; and he would have page 57 been made an officer of the Queen. You may be right (addressing Te-Ao-o-te-rangi); you are enumerating the faults of the Pakehas, of the Ministers, and of the Governor; but let those faults be distinctly stated, that they may be clearly seen. (To Mete Kingi:) It will be better that the Conference be at Port Nicholson, which is the elder brother; I mean the next Conference. It will be well that it should be in the summer or early autumn, that there may be food. Your word, Mete Kingi, is correct, that we should be always under instruction. The Bishop carries on his work by instruction; let the Governor carry on his by the same means; let us not listen to what may be told us by anybody, but what is spoken here may be received as correct. I think that one cause of trouble and difficulty in this Island is the land. I am trying to find out some good system of dealing with the land; but it will be proper that the Governor should have the arrangement of whatever plan may be tried amongst the Maori people. Let the Governor appoint the persons to direct and carry it out. This Conference is now set up as a light for both races; let this Conference beckon to the tribes who are going astray in following the old Maori customs, that they may return into the good way. My thought is that the Governor shonld select a European gentleman and a Native chief, to assist him in carrying out a system with reference to the lands sold by the Maories to the Governor. Their duty should be to supervise and to negotiate purchases, also to investigate and explain. By some such plan, in my opinion, a clear system might be carried out with respect to lands sold. to the Government, There is much more which I have thought of, and which I have written down in the paper which I hold in my hand. With respect to the Maori King project, I do not think it has been devised by the elderly men, but by the young men. Te Heuheu is the only old chief, but he is foolish; he is not like his elder brother. He came to us, and said to me, The great name of Te Rauparaha will be lost. I said to him, You are ambitious (I am not so), for you did not hesitate to carry the corpse of your elder brother to the summit of Tongariro. Return to your place, and occupy yourself with snaring tuis to set before your visitors.

Porutu, (Ngatiawa,) Wellington: All the words of this Conference have proceeded in the direction towards what is good. Yours also, Tamihana, are good. The Bishop does not stay always in one place, but be carries the Gospel to every place. As to what you say about(the meeting) being at Whanganui, I say it is for the Pakehas to say where it is page 58 to be. Mete Kingi's word is, however, right when he says let it be taken to his place that his people may see it. There are three places (Where his people Iive), viz.,—Waitotara, Whanganui, and Rangitikei; for ray part, I am going in darkness, therefore, I say, it is not through the Governor, but through Mr. McLean, that evil will befal us—through the Land Purchaser; he will prevent us from increasing,—he alone. There is no more to be said. All I say is we shall not thrive,—Mr. McLean Will prevent our doing so. Not until we see light and the sun shining shall we prosper. I retnrn to what I said. He will be the means of preventing our thriving. Why does he not look behind him? With whom is the fault? The fault is with Mr. McLean. The cause of my darkness is that I left my people in the South dark when I came away, and it is I alone who am now enlightened.

Tukihaumene (Ngatiwhakaue), Rotorua—addressing Waikato: Welcome, my son. Come with your difficulty which involves the great ones. He was not a small one in the Maori world, but he followed this scheme as a means of making himself greater. Welcome hither. You do not agree to the King; cease to uphold it. Let the promotion of this scheme be left to Te Heuheu, Turoa, and Te Moananui,—they are enough. [Ad-dressing the Nalive Secretary:] There is nothing wrong in what I say, though they say I am wrong. Perhaps you are in doubt as to the purport of my words. I am carrying myself like a dog (in subjeclion). That word is right. At home it will be the same. The King's word came to me to this effect; it is your word only that we are waiting for. I said, I will not agree to the King, not at all! If this setting up of a King had been from the Queen, it would be right.

Paora Tuhaere, (Ngatiwhatua,) Orakei: I rise to speak to what Tamihana has said about the land. I agree to his speech. It is a thought which I have in my heart that i should give my lands to the Governor, and that the Governor should send a proper person to survey them, and I will cut the boundaries when surveyed. Let a notice be publisbed in the newspaper that the Europeans, and also the Maories, may see. Let it be published for three or four months, and when it is seen that there is nothing wrong in the notice (no protest or objection), then let the Governor give a document for that land, which will enable me to sell it to the European, If it should be seen that, the page 59 map (or notice) describing the land is wrong (if the claim is disputed), then let a Committee settle it (by arbitration). But my thought, Mr. McLean, is that you should be the committee to look into the question. That is one of my thoughts. This is another. I refer to the Crown Grant; that is one of the things I very much wish to see given to the Maories, that is if the Governor should be willing to give us those documents; If the Governor grants this, then only will I say there is but one law.

Hapurona Tohikura (Ngatiapa Wanganui: I will not withstand the Governor's words. I will cherish them as my vitals and put them in my heart. This is another of my words I wish others also to see. Even as the work of a minister is to instruct, the Bishop instructs (his flock, so now the Governor must cause instruction to be constantly given. But let a conference meet at Whanganui, that our relations who are living there may also ee it.

Pehimana (Ngarauru), Waitotara: When the Ngatiawas sold their land from Tongaporutu to Ngamotu, Taranaki shared in the payment. When Colonel Wakefield's payment was given, the boundary was at Katikara, and on to Kaoa. When it (the payment) was taken to Taranaki, the boundary went on to Patea. The Ngatiruanui were excluded. From Patea on to Whenuakura, and on to Waitotara, is with me. My thoughts are busy about my land being sold by Potatau. I am living upon it, and it is drawn from under me by Potatau. The Ngatiawa migrated to Kapiti; Taranaki also and Ngatiruanui. I (Ngarauru) did not migrate; I remained upon my own land, and have done so up to this day. In the year 1859, I with my land, stood in the presence of the Governor and Mr. McLean. The arrangement was not concluded,—it still remains unsettled. I agree to the word of Mete Kingi where he says let the conference be held at Whanganui as a means of disposing of my difficulties. Do not let this be convened once only. Let us be-continually taught.

Ihakara Ngariri (Ngatiapa): Mete Kingi's word is not his own. Listen, O Governor, and this Conference. This word is from God: "Go ye and teach all nations." The Governor cannot altogether neglect that word. Let it be made known in all the places living in darkness. Let the Governor see my faults, and all about me. For [unclear: astance] Turoa: it said that the proposal page 60 about a King was his,—no doubt it is correct. Let the Governor go and see those places.

Hone Wiremu Hipango, (Ngatitumango) "Whanganui: Listen, ye people of the South, from Waitotara on to Port Nicholson. Listen all of you, This is my word. I wish you to consent to the word put forth by Mete Kingi that a Conference should be held at Whanganui. But I am thinking if Whanganui is the body, there is one wing long and one wing short: the Ngatiruanui side is the short wing—that is from them to Whanganui; the wing which is long is the wing towards Port Nicholson, including the Ngatikahungunu. Listen, my friends! The thing which I like is that the Governor call a Conference. I agree to this, and say it is good. When our gatherings for the administration of the Sacrament are called by the minister, and the people [unclear: assemble] at Whanganui, all the people come from Otaki and as far as Porirua. This is very good; there is no confusion, or difficulty. The majority agree to this arrangement and say—Yes, it is right. Listen, Mr. McLean, let a Conference be held at Whanganui. If it were a call from Maories to attend a Maori gathering, I would not agree to that. I should look upon that as coming from the mountains, and not from the Ocean. Listen, if i should I hear any evil words or of any evil deeds, I would stop my ears lest I should hear. But I will unstop my ears to hear good things. Listen, men of Waikato. I have a word respecting the name of Whanganui and of Pehi Turoa which has been brought forward here. It is a tree which others have reared, and the consequences fall upon Waikato, for you say thatTaupo and Whanganui have brought you into trouble. No, it was yourself, for has not Te Waka said—Waikato is the only independent tribe, and is above all the others? But no, I also am a man at my own place (have a standing of my own). Do not seek to be like the sparrow-hawk or the great hawk which prey on all the other birds. That will be wrong. I stand firmly upon my own land. Let this tribe and that tribe and the other tribe have their own thoughts. Say not that you are the greatest tribe, and above every other. No! no! That young lad who came to you acts as a child, and he sees some new game or dance, or something else, and at once joins in the thing. He is a child. What then is his name? Do you listen and hear his name. The name of that young lad is Te Mutu Mutu (Mutu, Maori for cease); And when he returned he ceased, cesed, ceased, for ever. Another was Pakau (Pa, page 61 Maori for touch); and he touched, touched and joined outright. Listen, another thing which is wrong is this: you Waikato are scheming to set yourselves high above others. Do not thus, My way is to make all level. Let me live as it were under the sole of the foot. My name is Tuku-Whenua (Land-sellers); the name of the men with you is Pupuri-Whenua (Land-holders). It is not my plan to withhold land anywhere. If the Governor call a Conference at Port Nicholson, to Port Nicholson I go; if it is called at Otaki, I will go to Otaki; if the Governor call it at Whanganui, it is well. Whanganui belongs to the Governor, so does Otaki, so does Port Nicholson: these places are all his. But if it is to be at Whanganui, I do not say make haste; it will depend upon whether fatness or leanness be found., 1, 0 Governor, am with you to lift up your hands. Enough: let Mr. Churton be the head or Chairman of our Council at Whanganui.

Hori Kerei (Ngatirauaka), Whanganui: I wish to speak about Crown Grants. I said to you at Whanganui—Give me a Crown Grant for Whiritoa, for the place which is within the European boundaries. This also I desire, that the word spoken by Mete Kingi be fulfilled, and that the second of these Conferences be held at Whanganui. When Christianity was first brought to us, I embraced it, and this also I desire to embrace. Listen to me, let there be a Conference at Whanganui; but if you prefer Port Nicholson, I shall say yes to that.

Parakaia Te Pouepa, (Ngatiraukawa,) Otaki:—Listen, Te Waka, I will follow upon what you have now said. What is the cause which has brought you here? Is it the Maori King? or is it Te Rangitake's affair? What you say is right; those two things are the cause of our coming to this Conference. We have thoroughly mashed up (discussed) the subject of Te Rangitake during these many days past; the bits that yet stick in my throat the Governor will clear away, and I will carry them to my place to do the some. There is nothing else which troubles me besides these two things.—There is Potatau; he sells Auckland to the Government, and then leaves the Europeans to themselves. He goes off to Waikato and sets himself up as a King; still his word is good. We have heard from Te Waka that his word was, Be kind to the Europeans. The report merely goes abroad that Waikato is setting up a King; Potatau's professions at the same time are good. This page 62 is also another word of his "Wash me, that I may be clean." My opinion is, that this Conference should take up Potatau's good words, that is, they should be written in a book, so that they may not be effaced. I rejoice at Te Waka's word, and therefore I say, Let this Conference take up (adopt) Potatau's word, that it may be on high, lifted up. I have been brought into trouble by this error. Wi Tako brought the flag to my land, and I then, for the first time, saw this evil thing. I have been brought into trouble through this thing of yours, O Katipa, my relative. I have been made the subject of a song for my adherence to the Queen.

"Who is thy friend, O Para(kaia)? That you vainly wander about among your dreams?

A fool thou art!"

This has caused me no slight pain. I have felt it deeply. But, I say to this Conference, I will wait. If the Queen's system come to nought, then I am wrong; but if the system of the Maori come to nought through the means of the gospel and the Queen's authority, then they (my opponents) will be found in the wrong in time to come.

Meeting adjourned to 23rd instant.

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