page 22

Waiomio. (Ngapuhi Tribe, subdivided into Ngatihine and Others.)

The Premier said,—Salutations to the Native race here assembled. On behalf of the Government I express to you our very best wishes. I am sorry you were disappointed last night. I intended to have remained on my way to Kawakawa and to have met you; but, however, that is past. I am here now, and am very pleased to see you. In the past, Ministers have gone to see the pakehas at their different centres, while they have not done the same with the Maoris. Now we are both one people, we are all New-Zealanders, and the Native has as much right to be consulted and advised as the pakeha. There is the one Queen, the one sovereignty, the sovereignty which your forefathers agreed to accept when the Treaty of Waitangi was signed. There is the one law, which is just as binding upon the Maori as upon the pakeha. We must all obey the law, or otherwise life and property would not be safe. So long as these laws are administered and obeyed by both races good will come. In regard to the making of laws, probably it will be to your advantage that I am here to-day. Now, I am here to-day more to listen than to speak: I will therefore listen to what you have to say. If you have any grievances, bring them before me, and any explanation you want I shall be only too happy to give. I want to ascertain the Native mind; I want to be frank; I want to let you know we are desirous of doing what is in your interest and in the interest of the colony. I have no doubt that you will, through one or two of your leaders, place several matters before me. I would therefore ask, so as to facilitate business, that there be no repetition, no two persons getting up and saying the same thing. I wish you to place your matters as shortly as you can before me. I am a good listener, and want to be your friend; therefore speak fairly, speak frankly.

Wiremu Pomare (nephew of the great Pomare) said,—Salutations to you. I am glad to see you here to-day, also Mr. Carroll. Come and see the Ngapuhis. If we had had sufficient notice that you intended coming here, perhaps you would have seen more of this great race, the Ngapuhi Tribe. On account of the short notice, these are all the people you see here assembled. We have nothing to say to you here, but we request your presence at Turanganui, where there is to be a large Native assembly. There you will hear all the complaints and all we have to say regarding the Native race. There everything will be explained to you fully.

Maihi Paraone said,—Salutations to you, the Hon. E. J. Seddon, and the Native Minister, the Hon, J. Carroll. We have nothing to say to you here, but we have had notice that a large meeting is to be held at Turanganui (Gisborne), and we ask you to be present at that meeting.

The Premier said,—I am delighted to find that you are all so well pleased and satisfied with the laws that exist; that you are a contented people, and have nothing to say except to accord me a hearty welcome. When pakehas do not complain, it is because they are satisfied: so, if you do not complain, you must be a contented, well-satisfied, and happy people. You understand your own affairs, and you are quite able to tell the Government your wishes, your requirements, and grievances, if you have any. I have been a long time on my journey, and have met some hundreds of the Native race, but this is the first place where I have met Natives who are without grievances and are satisfied with the laws as they stand. Do not say later on, in regard to the law's relating to land and other matters, that the Government did not see you and give you an opportunity of expressing your views. I may not reach Gisborne, I may not go there at all. If it so happened that I could not get to Gisborne, then I should not know anything about your requirements or wants. You have this opportunity, and if you miss it the responsibility is yours, and it does not rest with me. It is probable that I may visit Gisborne, but you can never tell—it is always best to make sure. You are sure of me now because I am speaking to you. It is not the ghost of the Prime Minister or Native Minister, it is the Prime Minister and Native Minister in person speaking to you. I am now going from you to meet the Natives at Waimate. I do not think they will tell me that I must go to Gisborne to hear their views. The representative of the Native race in the Government is also present, my friend Mr. Carroll. You have also another representative in Parliamient—the member for your district. He is your true representative, the one who goes to Parliament to help to make the laws. The representatives you send to Gisborne cannot make laws; they are absolutely powerless. They may go and hold a meeting and make many speeches and put forth their grievances, but they cannot give you any redress or pass laws. There can only be one Parliament, and we can recognise only the representatives elected to that Parliament. I may read what takes place at this Native meeting at Gisborne, but what will weigh with me more will be the utterances of your members in Parliament in respect to questions affecting the Native race. I always think it advisable to speak plainly, so that there shall be no misunderstanding. If you rely upon your representatives at the Gisborne meeting to grant you relief, you will be relying on a broken reed: not but they will do their best, but the responsibility of governing the country must rest with the Parliament. It is only right I should tell you this. You must not forget that there is a change coming over the face of the country. We have now nearly seven hundred thousand people in New Zealand, and only forty thousand of these are of the Native race, and it is owing to this change that I have desired to meet the Natives and consult with them in person, to warn them of the fact that exists, and to ask them to have confidence in the Government that desires to befriend them. The condition of the Native race in the colony is not satisfactory, page 23 They are rich in lands, they are large landed proprietors, and yet they are living in a state of poverty—almost of destitution. They are year by year growing less and less, smaller and smaller, and, if things go on as they are, the noble race in the course of a few years will be a thing of the past. We desire to improve the condition of the Natives; we desire to stop and prevent the race I have now described from being a thing of the past. We wish to find them increasing in numbers, living in prosperity, living in peace and happiness and contentment with the pakeha. I have told you very fairly the views of myself and the Government, and of the pakeha. You to-day, through two speakers, have spoken for a portion of the tribe; and, having very little to say more than to welcome me, I must naturally come to the conclusion that you are the only Natives in New Zealand who are satisfied with the existing state of affairs, and with the unfortunate position you seem to me to be in. With the pakehas we say, "Silence gives consent." That is an old saying, and every little child knows it, and in your case I must infer also that silence gives consent. I told you I was prepared to listen, and came here to listen. I will now conclude by thanking you for the personal and cordial welcome you have given to myself and to my colleague the Hon. Mr. Carroll, the representative of the Native race in the Cabinet. I am very pleased to have met you, and, considering the very short notice you have had, you have gathered together here a fairly representative meeting. I was sorry my movements were so uncertain that I was not able to give you as much notice as I could have desired. I feel sure, however, that had I passed by without coming to see you, you would have had a grievance. You have seen now myself and my colleague in person, and I think you will admit we are both "substantial" men. You have seen the Minister for the Natives, and not the Minister against the Natives. You have also seen the Minister representing the Native race in the Cabinet, the friend of the Native race—one of yourselves. He will now say a few words to you in your own tongue; perhaps you will understand him better than you have understood me. I thank you very kindly for the welcome you have accorded us.

Wiremu Pomare (to Mr. Carroll, after Mr. Carroll had delivered his address): What you said just now about our having no grievances is not correct. All are well aware that we have grievances. The Maoris are still crying out about the laws made in Parliament. We are glad to see you going from house to house and settlement to settlement, and seeing what grievances we have. Although we see you here to-day we are unable to express our opinions here, as we told you. We intend to discuss all these at a great meeting to be held in Gisborne, and to which we have arranged to send delegates. Conclusions might be arrived at there to insure that laws will be framed for the promotion of amicable relations between the two races. If the laws that you are going to make in future are to be like those you have made in the past, the Natives will not cease crying. You must not run away with the idea that we do not appreciate your coming here to-day. I say we value your appearance here to-day, and, as I said before, we will try and frame laws ourselves, and then ask Parliament to ratify them. Even though the Premier does not attend this meeting at Gisborne, we request that you, as the representative of the Natives, should attend there and hear all that is to be said, and try and help us to frame laws. Even though your chief, the Premier, should stay behind, we wish to see you there. You have stated that you have heard all the grievances in southern districts. Well, if those grievances are allayed we should certainly be relieved in parallel cases.

The Premier: There was rain on the hills, now when the sun shines it disappears. There was a mist when my friend last spoke. The mist that existed was, that I was of opinion you had no grievances. I was told you had nothing to say, and hence came to the conclusion you were a happy and contented people, and everything was going on well with you. Now the sun has just appeared and dispelled the mist, because he has told me you have grievances. He says I should know these grievances. I am not here amongst you every day, how is it possible I should know your grievances? I cannot know them until you tell them to me. He has only mentioned one, but I have no doubt that there are others, and if they have not been mentioned, the responsibility rests with you, and your not telling them to me when I am here. I can only come to the conclusion that they are not very serious. Now, you are entirely wrong when you say that we have listened to the other Natives, and when we relieve their grievances it will redress yours. I say you are entirely wrong in that. Now, they have differed in the different districts as we came along. For instance, the Maniapotos had a grievance, with which we have treated to their satisfaction. The Natives in the Waikato had a grievance of an entirely different character, and they wanted special relief. Now, the Ngapuhi and Ngatihine are degenerating if they desire their grievances to be made known through other tribes. The Ngapuhi are retrograding very much if they are to be spoken for by the other tribes. I am sorry I shall have to say so when I go back to Wellington. I shall have to say that amongst the Ngapuhi they have no speakers to make their wishes known to the Government; that as regards their oratory they are failing. Why, the early speakers of renown came from Ngapuhi. The Maoris can always make their grievances known to the Government. I must still adhere to the opinion that your grievances are not very great. Perhaps after I have gone, you will discuss matters amongst yourselves, and if later on you submit to me what you think requires my attention, I shall be glad to deal with it, notwithstanding your present reti- page 24 cence. I am perhaps telling the truth, and you may think I am thought-reading—reading your minds—when I tell you that I think the short notice you had was the means of stopping you from meeting amongst yourselves and deciding what you should say, and you have therefore taken up a negative position. It is the same cry, "Taihoa, taihoa" (Wait, wait). The world goes on and the Natives are disappearing, and still the cry, "Taihoa, taihoa." The time will come when you will find this is a mistake, and the sooner you recognise this fact and the position you are in the better. We have met as friends, and I trust we part as friends: let it be always so. Thanking you for your welcome and wishing you all well, I will now take my departure.