Claim of Heremaia Mautai and others to Kaitorete.

The Chief Judge delivered a very lengthy and elaborate judgment.

The Chief Judge said, with regard to the order of reference, that both himself and the Native Assessor were convinced that of all the properties which the Natives could possess, fisheries where most valuable to them He hoped,therefore,that the Government would give them fisheries where available.

Mr. Rolleston said he had been in communication with the Natives, and had asked several hapus to state the different places they wished to obrain as fisheries. He had obtained a list of places where it was ascertained these spots where available. He should be prepared with evidence as to what land the Natives had obtained under the Ngaitahu Deed; and, on behalf of the Crown, he would ask the Court to mention the extent of land to be awarded.

The Chief Judge said he could not do so. In the Kaitorete case, for instance, it seemed that Heremaia Mautai's People had been in the habit of cutting drains, for the purpose of eel fishing, on the land between Lake Ellesmere and the sea. Wherever it was possible, he should say that the simplest way would be to give the Natives their fisheries.

Mr. Cowlishaw stated that he did not think there was the slightest possibility of the Crown and the Natives agreeing. The Crown thought they ought not to do much, while the Natives thought they ought to do a great deal. They had a meeting the other day, and the Crown thought that three acres a piece was sufficient to reserve for the Natives in addition to the land they had already obtained, and the Natives thought otherwise.

The Chief Judge said that he couldn't suppose there would be any difficulty in the question as to quantity. If there was, they should of course be prepared to deal with it.

Mr. Rolleston: Would the court intimate, generally, by way of guidance to the Crown, what extent of land should be given, and not only that, but generally the nature of the spots, and the nature of fulfillment which would meet with the approval of the Court.

The Chief Judge: I should say, speaking in a way which I must not be bound by if the matter comes before me judicially, that this pah with the easement over the whole of the strip would satisfy the Natives, without giving them any freehold. That is, to give them leave to make a drain for eel fishing where they liked, filling it up again as they need to. That might be done without any injury to Europeans, while at the same time it would be very valuable to the Natives to have the privilege. According to Mr. White's evidence, the claimants have been doing this since 1860 or 1861.

Mr. Rolleston said he would bring Mr. Mantell to prove what had been done under the deed. He was prepared to give evidence as to what had passed between himself and the Natives; and he would like the Court to express an opinion as to what further quantity of land the Natives should get. The Crown would immediately carry out whatever decision was given by the Court, a release from the deed being obtained.

The Chief Judge said they should want evidence—first, as to the land used about the towns, then as to the fisheries, pahs, and burial grounds. The Natives would have to appear and speak on their own behalf. The fact of the election at Kaiapoi must not be allowed to interfere with the business of the Court. The sittings at Dunedin had aleady been put off from day to day.

Mr. Rolleston said that at a meeting on Saturday, each hapu appointed one man to speak on its behalf. They had not refused to come to terms, but he should like to obtain the opinion of the Court

The Chief Judge said he could not express any opinion at this stage.

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The Court then adjourned until 2 o'clock, in order that the cases might he arranged.

On resuming, Mr. Rolleston intimated that the Government would raise no objection to the reserves being made under the deed. But there was a stipulation which, on behalf of the Crown, he must insist on; that eel weirs and fisheries to be granted should not interfere with the general settlement of the country. Evidence would be brought before the Court to show, that at the time of the purchase of the Ngaitahu block, it was distinctly understood between the Commissioner and the Natives, that no rights would be granted which would interfere with the general settlement of the country.